Re: <nettime> Nettime Listening Post

[podinski via nettime-l <nettime-l@lists.nettime.org>]

Hi Christian x2, and all,

Thanks for reply...

Difficult to respond adequately right now.  A bit chaotic atm !

There's many intimidation factors that could probably need illuminating.

I am generally skeptical about all cybernetic petri dishes, even if it's
of our own making, which is anyway, NOT likely an accurate way of
describing whatver we build on cables + infrastructures + chips that we
do not own !

Our Xlterrestrials group has often seen - from our alien perspectives
over the last couple decades - that the whole range of
techno-evangelists to cyberpunks + cypherpunks to the Open Knowledge
types to Cyborg Manifestoans to the Declerators of Cyber
(neo-)Libertarian Independence thought that they were all creating a
"liberatory space".. And one can - and probably should - argue that they
ALL very poorly read the Systems of Techno-colonial Control that would
be coming down the pipe... and sadly STILL dont see what CANnibal soups
we're in !

And that is not to say we shouldnt continue to fight in this arena ! ...
but...

Intimidation - in part - comes from the fact that we cannot really even
imagine what the next perpetrating vulture capital plans will come with
their dirty krapitalist hands on all this BIG DATA SPILL and
FRENZY-FREE-FOR-ALL  ( well not really all, just all oligarchs ? )

...

But there are other intimidations, which i dont have time to try and
flesh out too much of that now...

They might relate to things like, why so little gender diversity
participates in nettime discussions, and that really should be better
understood to help make this a functioning platform for meaningful
discussions.

Another thing which Christian P. adds is also really interesting...

Hmm, Being able to self-publsih in such a way that it will NOT be in the
archive COULD be useful to some.

But not sure those kind of technical fixes will alleviate the fears that
could exist for any seriously engaged thinker or activist living in
various authoritarian regimes.

Currently, i am curious to go back and research the Twitter
problems/details that came about for people who were organizing during
Arab Spring, cause an article right no that warns people in the newer
Instagram era could be very important. And about the newer styles of
repression ( like in DE, which relates to the powers and strings of
state + inst. funds ). Not to be a fearmonger, but just to encourage
some caution.

Btw, Does anyone know a good article about that?

...

And another Intimidation species, which C.P. also mentions, the time factor.

If one wades into something that is a hotly debated topic...

one has to take a lot of time to articulate AND defend against all the
"attacks" that may come.

Things havent been all that adversarial here these days... it seems.

BUT w/ several thousand people, one never knows what might happen, which
is again why i advocate for the possibility of participating in some
kind of collective organism mode. A bit of a shield.

And these kinds of things may be in the minds of lurkers who may have
never posted at all.

which is very unfortunate when it comes to certain issues where
SOLIDARITY in NUMBERS is crucial to overcome the noise ( or the silence ).

...

quik messy sketches...

all for now,

p.









On 26/02/24 09:47, Christian Swertz wrote:
> Hello,
>
> thanks for your posting and the nice images you painted with your
> words. I really enjoyed reading them.
>
> I would like to ask one question about this one:
>
>> One thing that is missing from David's recap was an aspect raised about
>> the intimidation factors ( also related to the Silence themes of late ),
>
> Do you assume that the nettime-l archive is an intimidation factor and
> thus prohibits people to post unusual or provocative ideas since they
> could be attacked for that later with reference to the archive? As far
> as I see, this cannot be denied. Even if the archive itself is
> certainly not the crucial problem (all subscribers get all the mails
> anyway), this could be the expression of a larger social problem. And
> I fully agree that this problem is obviously connected to power dynamics.
>
> Can we assume that all media are some sort of laboratories were people
> are sitting in Petri-dishes (I really like your image of media as
> Petri-dishes!)? If so, we also have to assume that the laboratories
> were created by people. In this situation, we can not avoid sitting in
> a laboratory - but we do not have to sit in other peoples Petri-dishes
> - we can create our own ones. The disadvantage certainly is that we
> have to blame ourselves for the food we get. But we might create a
> better filling of the Petri-dish - or even a new laboratory. Im thus
> curious to get to know your ideas about improving our little
> laboratory here (or about creating alternatives one - I actually love
> to move between laboratories. Would you share your toughts with us?
>

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